What is the Army Museum Enterprise ? How many artifacts such as uniforms , weapons and equipment does the army have ? How does the Army Museum Enterprise help educate the force for answers to these questions and more insights . Welcome to the U . S . Army history and Heritage podcast . The official podcast of the United States Army Center of Military History . The Center of Military History , writes and publishes the army's official history , manages the US Army Museum Enterprise and provides historical support throughout the U . S . Army . Hello everyone and welcome to the United States Army history and Heritage podcast . I'm lee Reynolds , the strategic communications officer for the Center of Military History . In this episode , I'm speaking with Colonel brian W . Hunt , the director of the Army Museum Enterprise . We'll be talking about the vast amount of artifacts the army maintains , how army museums contribute to force development and how soldiers and civilians can visit army museums . Welcome Colonel Hunt and thanks for joining me . Thank you for having me . Well , I'm excited to be here . We're actually recording this at the Museum Support Center . We'll talk about that a little bit later . Let me just give them a little background about you and let them know who you are . So Colonel brian W . Hunt is the director of the Army Museum Enterprise , which is a directorate within the United States Army Center of Military History . He joined the Army in 1987 as a 19 Delta Calves . Scout enlisted 1st . He served in I troop both in both the second a cr and third a cr . He served as a driver gunner and Bradley command on the M three cavalry fighting vehicle . He served in Desert Shield and Desert Storm . He left active services as a sergeant to go to college . He served in the California National Guard while attending college and he received his Bachelor of Arts degree in history from cal poly at san luis Obispo , commissioned in 1996 as an infantry officer , left your armor routes there . I see . His assignments include mechanized platoon and mortar platoon leader , light infantry staff and company command . He served as an observer controller and trainer at the National Training Center at Fort Irwin California . He was with the Canadian Maneuver Training center , Canadian Force , Canadian Forces base wing , right and at the Joint multinational Training Center in Holon Feld's Germany he deployed to Iraq as a transition team chief for the Iraqi National Police in 2007 , 2008 . And as the Romanian American Battle Group , Deputy Commander in Zabul Afghanistan in 2009 and 10 , Colonel Hunt has served in a variety of staff positions to include at U . S . Strategic Command Office , Program Management , Saudi Arabia National Guard and in the Canadian Army doctrine and training center . That's a that's a very diverse career . That's that's pretty impressive . I've had a a career that's probably not the normal infantry career , but it's been a fun one so far . So infantry officer . That's your background . How did you end up being with the Army Museum Enterprise . Well I I think it's the aim the aim of talent management uh system now . Right so now you get to see all the jobs that are open and available . Uh I saw that this job was open . I contacted the old director kind of asked him what what went on with the job and then contacted my branch chief and said that I was interested and then you know what went through the same process . So you know it was uh it was a great opportunity . Um Well you're a history major . Yeah so this kind of falls in line with your own personal interest . Yeah . And uh so as a history major at a at a engineering school . So I've got no concentration . So I just kind of took broad subjects and and I think it kind of fits this this network here of just a diverse eclectic type of history . All right well great . Well welcome and um this is exciting the Army Museum enterprise . So for our listeners , can you describe what the A . M . E . Is all about ? So the army really is designed to preserve the history of the US Army by collections , exhibiting and presenting the and preserving the artifacts that reflect the material history of the US army and the individual soldiers stories . Um and some family stories . We get some donations about family life that's occurred in the army . So it's really the material , the preservation and um exhibiting of the material culture of the US army , you know , you're talking about the families I know recently at Fort Leavenworth the museum there , they have a whole exhibit about the Girl Scouts at Fort Leavenworth and I found that fascinating . But it was hand in hand with the soldiers and the soldier families . Sure . I mean , I think if you go to my daughter was a Girl Scout at Fort Jackson and you know , I think you go to almost every army base and you'll see a very active Boy Scout , Girl Scout , um , you know , detachments or , or things there . So I think it's , you know , it's part of providing those , those outlets for families , right ? Because soldiers are gonna do what the soldiers are , are designed to do . But in the meantime there's families that are still on the installation or around the installation that would like to be involved in in the life there . So . Absolutely . And having museums that installations I think is a great way for families to get involved to learn more about the , the culture about what their their family is doing in the military . So let's talk about that for , for a second . Where are army museums , How many do we have ? And where are they located ? So we have uh , 37 museum activities meaning that there's there's 37 museum buildings , um , and four training support facilities . So training support facility is really a massive 30 to 50,000 square foot warehouse um designed for , for macro artifacts . So , vehicles , rockets , artillery pieces , those types that kind of stuff . Yeah . Uh and we have one that they actually uh brought in a an atomic cannon . So it's a cannon on a rail car and they had to bring that in before they could build the building , which is that , So that's the ordinance training support facility down at Fort lee . Um and then we have two museums support centers , one here that we're at at Fort Belvoir and then wanted down at anniston at the army depot at Anniston Alabama . What's the purpose of the museum Support centers ? So the museum support centers are really purpose built facilities um To store the artifacts , most museums have about 10% of their artifacts on display at any given time and 90% are stored . And it's interesting as , as research and time goes by , what we start to understand is is the environmental considerations that actually erode and decay artifacts . Uh So there we've got army regulations that are really tied to industry standards that are established by the Alliance of american Museums that provides for humidity and temperature control because that's just absolutely critical to the artifacts . Even uh what type of boxes like , you know , we unpacked things that soldiers packed up and you know , when units deactivated or you know , from World War two , Vietnam and they were putting just wooden boxes . Well , some wood off gasses , some wood is treated and that actually becomes corrosive to the artifacts or enables infestation of bugs and things like that that will eat away at those artifacts . Or you can have a , a chemical reaction from different types of metals uh , that are stored together . And so so these , these facilities especially built to have the right environment , clean air , certain temperature and staffed and staff for people to when we pull artifacts off of an exhibit or get donated an artifact . Um , they make an assessment , they do some preservation work , then they store it correctly . Uh , and then , and so that's like , you know when you , when you have a uniform , you actually have to put things under between the buttons and the cloth because it can , it can uh , tarnish and , and corrode . And so , and then they , so all acid free no off gassing . And then they put them into boxes and then they put them into uh cabinets that are limit the airflow . So uh , to to really preserve this because part of our mission is the preservation of these artifacts for the next generations of americans . I mean , this is , this is the army's history and heritage that we store here . Sure . And you can look , you look at a uniform uh , from World War One and you can see differences like you've got the standard brass disc on the on the collar . Then all of a sudden you'll see a uniform we have in the back here at belvoir and it's got engineer embroidered branch insignia . Well those were french , so they had a made in France and attached to the uniform . And when you , when you think about climbing in and out of a trench and doing all the activities that you do in in combat , like people lose buttons , they lose applets , they lose material , right ? Uh So when they sew it on there , that's somebody that really cared about being identified and what their role was . Um And so you can start telling kind of what the characteristic of of a person was and the activities that they were doing in combat . So you mentioned that 10% of most museum artifacts are on display . Is that the same case throughout the Army Museum enterprise . Um it's probably a little less than 10% just because we , you know , at the 37 locations were on 30 installations , so we have some installations that have multiple museums on them . Uh how many artifacts in the army collection ? So there's roughly about 580,000 artifacts . Um And we are decreasing those because some of these were , you know , as as a army developed museums , museums were just kind of developed by command emphasis um and and they hired people that were directors and um and not necessarily museum professionals . Now what we have are museum professionals , they have master's degrees in museum studies . Um They know how to preserve and build storylines to actually create exhibits , but they , what we found is we have a lot of repetition . We have a lot of the same stuff . And if it's not actually on display in an exhibit , do we need 100 types of this uniform or do we need some that have actual precedents to a historic individual or a campaign that was actually used in combat ? Or is it just somebody's grandpa's uniform out of the attic ? Well , yeah , I mean in my role as the strategic communications Officer , I , I'm getting emails and calls from people a lot saying , you know , grandpa just passed away . We found his uniforms . They , we want to donate it to the museum . And so I usually refer them back here to you all . So that is very common . So what do you do when somebody wants to donate , whether it's a uniform or a piece of equipment . So if there's an army museum locally , they can get in contact with that museum director . So there is a process , um , first will get information on , on what the item is . Get a little bit of historical data . It tends to help if it's more than , hey , my grandfather fought in , you know , Korea and this is his uniform would know no other information that's doesn't really help . Um , but if it's , my grandfather was part of this division fought in this campaign and you know , this uniform was actually worn and a little bit of history . Uh It goes to the museum oil it . The information goes to the museum . The museum director then brings it into the collections committee . So the collections committee are members across the army Museum enterprise . They sit there , they review it . They make sure that the army doesn't have a whole lot of that . If if we have a whole lot of it then they have to start looking at . Is this a better example of an artifact ? Or is uh is there a hole in our collection ? Is there a gap that we don't have ? And then so they'll refer either recommend or decline ? And uh and so if it's recommended then we'll process it with with paperwork because in the end the donation is given free and clear to the art . But I think it's important for people to know that , not just because people want to donate it , the army isn't necessarily going to accept it for for one reason or another . All right , so let's get back to the museums . Um You said that there's a 37 different activities . Where are they ? Where is it , is it just the United States or the overseas . So we're in 17 states . Um and then to foreign countries . So we we have museum in Korea which is starting to it was rebuilt . It was a purpose built museum there . Um And there are now putting in the exhibit . So it it will open up uh sometime in september october of 2022 . And it is it's still called the second Infantry Division museum . Yeah well it's the Eighth Army second Infantry music . And where is that ? In Korea ? So there's no sin or no . But yeah it's I know they moved um they moved south out of Souls and I've never been to Korea so I know you're missing out . Yeah and then you said we've got one or two in Germany , so there's technically two in Germany , there's one in in the usual headquarters . Um And then there's uh one down end Vilsack . And so that's the reed Army museum um down in Vilsack . And then throughout the United States um there basically on active duty posts mostly around active duty posts . There there may be a few posts that don't have a museum but for the most part it's so if somebody wants to visit , somebody is listening to this and their civilian and they want to visit an army museum but they're not sure if they can get on post , how can they do that ? So most installations have a visitor center . So if you want to go on to the base you just contact their visitor's center and then it's a matter of filling out a form . And I think a lot of it's uh real I . D . You have to have a real I . D . Driver's license or documentation to get onto the post and you can say that you just want to visit the museum and all army museums are free and they do vary some some are opened uh Tuesdays through Saturdays and some are open monday through Fridays . And the good thing is on our website history dot army dot mil . We have a museum tab right at the top so and it's got a great locator . So if anyone does want to visit a museum you can go to that museum tab . Um You can look forward by state and it will give you all the information it gives you all the hours . Um And also I think you can contact the museum and you can get that information on how to access the post . So but I think we're now we've got some some museums that are starting to um open new facilities that are off post . In fact one in texas . Let's talk about that real quick . So um you know post 9 11 access to installations is you know not as easy as it once was . Um And so we've been able to procure um museum properties or the one in texas at Fort Hood is right outside the main gate of Fort Hood and it's actually on the installation but outside of the fence line . So free public access . You don't have to go through a gate or anything like that . And that was actually a gift from a foundation . So they did a capital campaign . They got with the installation . um and they drove the building of this . Um And so it was really a a win for the army . We had two museums , we had uh third calvary regiment museum and the first calves museum , both on the installation . But they were focused on those units . This museum is actually focused on mounted warfare , so now it's taking the artifacts from those museums . So a large part of those museums will have the history and kind of story of the units that occupy Fort Hood , but it's really gonna talk about how the army transitioned really from Horse Two . Mounted Warfare . Yeah , I think it's called the National Mounted Warfare Museum . I think National Mounted Warrior Warrior Museum . Alright , great . Well that's that's exciting and hopefully that's a good trend but I I think it's good that people understand no matter where the museum is , if it's on post or off post that they can access it and get out there and see it . And we just did a ribbon cutting last week at Fort Drum , they moved their museum right outside one of the gates and they've opened up a really nice brand new facility there . Um And you know it talks about the 10th mountain division uh And it's just really a great new uh Oh great . So if anyone in upstate new york there , they need to stop by , I mean all these museums are fascinating , but why is it important to have army museums in communities around the nation ? So the US army really isn't regimental e structured anymore , like like our european counterparts , right ? You don't go in a regiment for life . Um , and so as we transition and we move around the army , it's incumbent upon us to learn the history of those organizations to understand the spree decor or develop some esprit decor in the organization that we're going to be a member of and the museums help us do that . They allow us to understand the history of those organizations as a transition through time and why um , certain battles were significant , why certain pieces of equipment were significant in that organization's history . Um , and so it just allows us to be a better member of that . And then as a family member , it allows us to identify with the uh , with your soldier and the actual installation so that you can kind of understand about the history to uh , so when things are being discussed , you're , you're actually an active participant . Yeah . Yeah . And you feel more rooted in that community . Um , and especially when families are moving around every 23 , maybe four years , um , it's a great way to welcome uh , those families to that new community and to better understand the community , right ? And our divisions are very diverse . Right ? And so , and and they've changed , they've changed through time . You know , we have some divisions that have been uh light and then mechanized and striker . And , and so they go through a process of maturing with time , uh , and the requirements of the nation . And so that's kind of what the museum allows people to understand . It also , um , provides outlets for researchers or other people to go to , um , like that atomic cannon that we're talking about . You know , we had research and developers looking at those artillery pieces to figure out about how to develop long range fires . So , uh , we also provide an outlet uh , for research and development . And I know that a lot of these , these posts , whether it's , it's a training post or it's just a regular post , they'll bring the units in the soldiers in and um , they're learning more , you know , just about their , their history , um , and the history of the equipment that they're using . And I think that's fascinating . Yeah . So we , we do have a few museums that have a gear faith program that allows for soldiers to come in or units to to come into the museum . And then they kind of talk about the gear that the army is providing so that they understand that it's designed to protect and save them . And so it develops faith that that they're going to be protected . Um , if they they execute their operation like they were trained to do , um , we're looking to preserve their life , right ? And so , uh , it's important to know . Sure . And I mean , and you look at the development over time of just weapons systems and and protecting right helmets and things like that . It's a it's pretty fascinating how far we've come . Um , but when you see it in a museum and you see it in an exhibit , uh , you know , and you go look at a World War One helmet and then you look at a World War Two helmet and all of a sudden you look at the early Kevlar and now you look at the new helmet , right ? And you're , I mean , it's pretty fascinating and you you understand the reason why those changed over time and it really all gets down to um , safety preserving life well . And you look at the technology . So , you know , we have a training support facility down at Fort Benning , that's the armor , calf training support facility . And you go look at a World War one tank and it's riveted . Right ? And so a riveted tank , because that was kind of the technology at the time . Um I mean , you're you're talking about uh steel construction and the development really of that type of creation of a device , right ? So it's more than just a tractor . But yeah , ships were riveted , right ? And then , so , but a tank , all of a sudden on the battlefield gets hit by a projectile and the rivets pop and it looks like a hairpin falling , you know , blowing apart . Right ? And so that information was developed , brought back research and development done and all of a sudden welding became a primary means of creating a tank and sealing the structure to actually protect the crew from catastrophic strike . Um And and so you see this over time and then you look at uh M . Wraps and M . A . T . V . S . And and how all of a sudden they're designed to when they when they get struck , they go into crumple zones and and it protects the crews inside . So it's absolutely fascinating to look at the development of our our machinery uh just over time and you don't get that . Yeah , you got to visit and see it . But these museums also have a , I think an importance with the local communities as well , not just the on post on based communities , but the local communities . It's like a handshake , isn't it ? It's it's good community relations people learn more about , you know , why do I have this army base here ? Sure . I mean you can look at like Fort Jackson . So in 1917 , Camp Jackson was created by the um what is it ? The the local board , like the Chamber of Commerce . Right . So they purchased the land and donated the land to the army to build one of the training bases for World War One . To develop the , the expeditionary force . Well , there there are those type of bases in those developments and the economic benefit that a military base provides to local community is absolutely uh fascinating . But you also look at how those communities were developed and they're they're really interwoven with that military base and you can see those relationships develop over time . Uh Fort Sam has a great example of that . There used to be uh you know parties that would go on in the old quadrangle in the historical part of the installation um that were very significant to the social life of san Antonio . And so you don't get that if if they can't access the museums and and then come in and learn that history to , yeah it's a it's a great handshake . I think that's what I like to call it to to the community . And um and you know it also serves a great recruiting benefit . People come in and understand the history why it's there and what the army has done over time . And one of the things I'd like to talk about um one part that I've seen in every museum I've gone into is not just the battle stuff that that we're talking about but its armies contributions to society as well and those local communities . I mean well and you look at so we have the women's army museum . Right ? So the contribution of women to the U . S . Army has been around since the U . S . Army has been around . You know you have molly pitcher , you have mary walker , you have all of these significant contributions . So the army is actually um and what the american culture is and so I think that that's one of the things that we like to showcase that we represent the american people as the U . S . Army and we can show that through artifacts and material culture and in in many ways the army has been on the leading edge of societal change And um you know we've seen that with women , we've seen that with the the integration act and that was in 1948 . Um you know 9981 . And uh yeah and but you get to see this in in the museums and I think that's what's great and I hope people who are listening will get a chance to visit our army museums around the country with or in Korea and Germany and to understand the army's contributions not just to the safety and security of the United States but also um to the to the communities around them . And and talking about that we have the new National Museum of the U . S . Army . Is that part of the Army Museum Enterprise ? So it's part of the museum enterprise as in uh So the army Museum enterprise provides governance over the collection that's there inside of the museum but it is a separate museum from the organization that I kind of deal with And and that's a fascinating one too . And just like the museums we're talking about a 10th mountain division and the new one at Fort Hood , it's off post . So it's it's just outside of Fort Belvoir where we're recording this today and people can go and they don't don't have to worry about , you know , going through a security gate , they can just go into the museum . Right ? I mean it's really close to uh to the national capital region . So if you're coming to go to the Smithsonian or something like that , I mean it's just right down the road . Uh What a great facility . I mean just large campus . Uh and it is uh it is world class and uh um so now I also want to talk a little bit about part of the Army Museum Enterprises , the army art program . Can we touch on that a little bit and talk about that in World War One . They the Corps of Engineers actually commissioned some artists . And so they developed some art . And then in the interwar years uh they disbanded this program in World War Two . Then they developed an army art program where we had some artists . So we've kind of kept that on . So now we have one Army artist combat artist in the museum enterprise that gets tasked to go throughout uh wherever the army is . We've sent them to Africa . We've sent them to Afghanistan and we link them up with army units and the artists will do some art based on the situations that are there . Um And so it's part of the thought of capturing uh army life on canvas . And so absolutely fascinating program . We even have some art that's been donated from artists that are in the army that are just in units , um , that have done paintings and done sketches and things like that and and want to donate it . And it kind of talks about , you know what they were facing in the army , right ? We've got a vast collection of art here and we're gonna have future podcast on the army art program . But I just think it is part of the army Museum and Price . So I just wanted to to bring that up and make sure people are aware of this program . Yeah . And , and so uh here at Belvoir , we have about six , just over 16,000 pieces of art . Um , but then we also have an art collection at West Point and that that's a lot . And so that goes kind of um , it's a lot of art from the cadets . And it's interesting . So it's uh , it may be just the good art that they kept because when I was there , I didn't see any bad art . But I would have , I would have loved to see a sketch or something from custard or somebody right or McArthur . Um , but maybe get their little doodles on the right . But I guess that those type of things weren't kept or donated . Um , and then talking about West Point , you would know better than me . But was that our first museum ? Yes . So that was the first museum and it's also an influential american art area . So you have the Hudson Valley Art School and so you have a lot of art that is kind of linked in , you know , the late 18 hundreds into the Hudson Valley art kind of things . So they have a lot of that type of art in our collection up there at West Point . So at our museums , are there any special exhibits , are there now or in the near future ? Um or any key artifacts that you think is kind of exciting or important for people to know about and should maybe , you know , plan to visit . Um So I think if you're in uh the midwest Fort Riley is a in in the fall will open up . So we just went through a multi year historical restructuring or reconstruction of the museum buildings of the US calvary Museum and the First Infantry Museum there . Um Just awesome native Kansas stone buildings . Uh and they're they're gonna put their , they're fabricating their exhibits . And so those will reopen . So I think that's probably a must see if you're in the Kansas area . Um and then think other exhibits . We just uh married up a collection from uh a service member , a female that we got her collection in her uniform and the whole collection is now back on exhibit at Fort lee at the women's Museum . And so that's that's that's pretty interesting to actually . Um yes , we've highlighted that on our social media as well . So . Good . Excellent . Alright . And then , um we've already talked about the new museums that's opening . But the one at ford Hood , when when do you anticipate that opening ? So that that design was just completed . And so now we expect probably by fall for the fabrication of the exhibits to to go out to contract . So it will probably be about a year before it opens . And yeah , so , um , when you say a year just because this podcast people listen to it anytime , but we're looking at maybe the summer of 2023 , probably late summer of 23 into the , into the fall just because their supply chains issues . Absolutely no . Uh , totally understand that . Um , So what else do you think it's important for people to know about the army museum enterprise that we haven't discussed ? So a lot of our museums have foundations that are linked to them , private organizations that really help us out with volunteers ? Uh docents individuals that maybe have a little bit of free time that are interested in history or the community and would like to share that as people come in to visit . Uh , so anybody that's interested in history or volunteering , I think if they get in contact with their local museum director and just ask them about ways that they could help out and volunteer . Um , We are always looking for that . It's exciting . Yeah . Yeah . If you have a passion for history and especially military history , what a great opportunity . Yeah and it's it's just a way to give back uh to the next generations of americans that come into the museum's excellent and you know , before we close uh it's time for my favorite segment who trivia . So um this is where you know , if you have a piece of significant army trivia that we can bring up something that I'm hoping will wow the audience and certainly wow me . So is there some piece of army trivia that you want to share about the A . M . E . So um going back to the West Point art collection . So when I was up there and looking um one of the things I like to ask our curator , Xyz , what's your most favorite object in the back of the museum ? And they pulled out and there's actually 22 pieces . So they pulled out a piece of art . And now West Point cadets used to have to take art classes , They had an actual formal art course and a lot of it was just parody . It was , the instructor would go to europe , get a piece of art , bring it back to the U . S . And then the cadets would would learn how to create that art through kind of observation . Uh well there is a pencil sketch of a greek warrior by William Tecumseh Sherman , that is absolutely fabulous from when he was a cadet from when he was a cadet and when you think of Tecumseh Sherman you know here's this this kind of no nonsense you know general and uh and he was actually skilled maybe a renaissance man right ? Like I mean to me that was shocking . Like I kind of see him with a cigar in his mouth and just kind of you know uh not taking any guff . Um And then there was another piece you know um same error . But it's uh it was Grant had a watercolor that was like something that you'd probably hang in your house . But it was actually signed U . H . Grant and then he came back as president and signed it US Grant , he resigned it . So he resigned because his his real middle name was Hiram . So but what on his West Point application they put Us Grant instead of you H Grant . And so as that he just eventually adopted us Grant . Well that's another great bit of trivia . So yeah so that's how interesting . Well very good . Well thank you so much . This has been very interesting and exciting because yeah I mean I'm clearly a fan of of history especially army history and I love going to the museums . I I haven't been to all of our museums but I've been to many of them and they're fascinating and really encourage people to go and visit and just a reminder . People can find these museums through our website at history dot Army dot nil . The museum tab is right in the top and you can find a museum near you when um every once in a while we'll you know on those museum pages . They have selections of their exhibits and artifacts just as a little tease uh to try and get people in . But uh great well thank you so much Colonel Hunt for for joining me today and this discussion and insights about the Army museum enterprise . And if anyone wants to learn more about the A . M . E . Or more about army history in general please go to the website at history dot army dot nil . And um if you want to learn more about army history in general then please visit our social media on facebook twitter and instagram . It's a very active social media and we do museum monday every monday we're highlighting a new muse a different museum of different artifacts or different exhibits . So please check that out and then join us every week on this podcast for more in depth discussions as we cover topics from all eras of U . S . Army history , examining battles , soldier experiences , equipment , weapons and tactics . Thanks for joining us today on the United States Army history and heritage podcast for the center of military history , I'm lee Reynolds and until next time we're history . The views expressed in this podcast reflect those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views , policies or opinions of the US Army or Department of Defense . For more information about the Army's proud history and heritage , go to history dot army dot mil .