did you know that the army has an artist in residence program ? What is the role of the combat artist ? What is combat art and why is it important to the army for answers to these questions and more army artists insights . Stay tuned . Welcome to the U . S . Army history and Heritage podcast . The official podcast of the United States Army Center of Military History . The Center of Military History writes and publishes the army's official history , manages the US Army Museum enterprise and provides historical support throughout the U . S . Army . Hello everyone and welcome to the United States Army history and Heritage podcast . I'm lee Reynolds , the strategic communications officer for the Center of Military History . In this episode , I'm speaking with sergeant first class Curtis loader . The current army artists and residents were discussing the role of the combat artist and the history of the program . Welcome sir Sergeant loader and thanks for joining me today . Thank you . I'm glad to be here . It's a great opportunity to talk about things . Absolutely . I mean the combat art and the artist in residence program is one of the main things I learned when I first joined the Center of Military history that I had no idea about . So I'm anxious to get the discussion going myself . But first let's get a little bit of background on you . So sergeant first class loader is the current army artist and residents . He received a Bachelor of Arts degree in Graphic Design and Fine art from Iowa State University in 2005 . He joined the army in 2007 as a multimedia illustrator . In 2008 he deployed to Afghanistan as a combat photographer with the 55th combat camera And was attached to the 7th special forces group for the duration . He later served as a graphic artist with the Army visual information directorate at the pentagon and was then assigned to the US Special Operations command at fort Bragg . There , he worked in all three visual information jobs in the army , including photography , graphic design and maintenance . He also served with the Black daggers parachute demonstration team and with a psychological warfare unit before being selected as the army artists and residents in 2019 . So that's some pretty exciting stuff there . Certain loader . Um uh tell me more about yourself , What am I missing ? Um Well that's a very big snippet of of my career . Um It's been really , really interesting . I've had a lot of opportunities to do a lot of different things as you can obviously tell . But you've also had a passion for art or your life is what it seems like . Oh absolutely . I've , I've been doing art since probably about the third grade when I started giving my teachers drawings uh during the day . I bet your parents refrigerator was full with with artwork . Oh , absolutely , absolutely . I would . I'd give my teacher's artwork . Um as I was coming up probably when I was supposed to be doing something else . But I mean it happens back then , you know . Well I find it fascinating that someone that has such an interest in art and you know you went to college and you studied graphic design and fine art there . So how did you become a soldier ? What drew you to the army ? Oh wow . So I've had this conversation with my family recently . We have extensive history of people in the military and I didn't really even know it . Um just growing up you in the midwest you get bombarded with a lot of different military movies and everything else that you see and it was really kind of interesting . So um growing up I always wanted to be a animator for Disney . Yeah , it was one of my ultimate goals and I was actually starting to work on that in high school towards getting that . And then I had a presentation of graphic design . A couple of Iowa state students came in and they were from Bettendorf and they came into the high school and gave us a presentation . I was like , oh that's really interesting . So I went and did that and I actually went and was applying for the Air Force Academy in , in high school . I missed the deadline by like two weeks . Ouch Well their loss , you know , it was good for us . Exactly . And then um I needed a little discipline after getting off of getting out of college . I did a little bit of research and found that the army actually has a graphic design position , which is a 25 Mike multimedia illustrator . So I went into the , into the recruiting office and was told him I wanted that position . Oh well great . And yeah , probably a lot of people don't know that about how you have a passion in art and you can um there's a place for you in the army . Yeah , it's absolutely there's there's a million different things you can do art wise and in the army and there's always a drive and desire for art in the army . You see it all over the place . Most people don't really pick up on it and it's kind of interesting seeing how much people want to see art and how much people like to see art . There's so much talent in the army . A lot of our soldiers are are fantastic artists , you know serving overseas um in Iraq especially you saw artwork everywhere um on on walls , you know murals that people did on their vehicles . And in fact we have some of that artwork like from from doors and um other things um are on display in in the or on display in the national museum or in some of our other museums around the army . Um And yeah that's pretty impressive . So now you join the army but you didn't become the army artist right away . Right . So uh and I think that's one of the great things about the army art program is you've really got a serve as a soldier for a while before you're even considered for the artist program , is that correct ? Absolutely , sir . This is a very high level position . It's a it's an actually eight master Sergeant position um that you have to apply for . It's a one of one position that you have to be selected for and you have to meet certain requirements and have a good um record and portfolio to do it and um experience in the army as a soldier . Because if you're going to capture the life of soldiering , you have to understand what it is to be a soldier . Oh absolutely . There's along with that you have to you have to bring so many different sets of skills to bear on this . Um Because you have to be not only just technically proficient in your fine art work , you have to be technically proficient because you are going to deploy and go document soldiers in their real environment . Well that's that's a good segue into the next topic . Which is what does an army artists do . So yeah , tell me what is your job ? My job is absolutely amazing . So I get to create fine artwork for the army where it can be displayed in many of the museums that surround this country . And I do that through documenting soldiers doing their daily work . Whether that's a combat environment or a stateside or training or um learning or assisting other people and uh I get to create fine artwork and tell their story , tell the greater army story . Um , um , clearly . But um , so how do you document it ? You you you sit there with , with an easel , watch soldiers and draw what talk me through this ? What's the process ? So I work in a couple different ways . Um , so I take a lot of photography . So I apply that skill set that I've developed throughout my career . And I do some onboard sketches as a as a basis for what I'm trying to do as well . And I bring that back um from the field . And then I create uh paintings and other different types of media , um , and finished uh polished pieces and a sketchbook to use a sketchbook to . I've seen that with a lot of artists . Yeah , yeah . So I have several different sketchbooks and I I work and I got notes and um , sketches and all sorts of different plans and everything throughout those sketchbooks . So why is army are important or relevant today ? When we have cameras and we've got video capability , I mean , we can document everything a lot easier . Why art ? So this is the biggest question I get almost with every single person I talked to . And I have a very definitive answer to that . It's photography and videography can capture a moment . A painting or a piece of artwork can tell a story . Uh with photography and videography , especially within the army were not allowed to manipulate or actually um change any piece of the photograph to um , at all , it has to be accurate to life . Absolutely . There's several different circumstances of people getting in trouble for manipulating a photograph even in a minute way , even cropping , it can change the story . Yeah , but with us we can we can change , we can do whatever we need to to actually tell the representation of what actually happened . Um One of the good explanations I have is we can make a rucksack look as heavy as it actually feels . Um We can add a little bit of emotion to somebody's face . We can use color theory , we can use um motion , movement , uh , composition and a bunch of other things to add feeling and emotion to a to a piece of artwork . And you can add something to the background to help illustrate or or tell that story even more . Oh , absolutely . So , so it's not just a moment in time , it's , you're telling a story of a soldier's day or specific battle or something like that . Absolutely . So one of the , one of the ones I'm working on right now is my third piece from my trip to Syria . And right now it's kind of , I'm taking numerous different photographs that I that I acquired while I was over there and I'm combining them into one piece And to think about it . Normal military convoy , your vehicles are going to be at least 100 m apart . Um , that's a hard thing to capture a lot of vehicles in one photograph . Uh , but with the painting , I can put them all together and I can actually convey like what's going on . I can um , put things in there that time date and geo locate the the area and tell the soldiers story so that when they see that painting , they can instantly relate to it because that is my ultimate goal is get soldiers and veterans That were there to instantly relate to the painting . Yeah , I think that's a real key point , you know , from the army art that I have seen . You know , I'm I'm I'm a veteran 35 years in the army and whether I'm looking at art from that was drawn during my career or even beforehand , I can really look at that and totally um , um , associate with it . It really triggers emotions in me as , as a veteran . Yeah , that's uh , that is the ultimate goal is you want to create this kind of bond between not yourself and the the viewer , but between the viewer and the piece of artwork , you want to you want them to enjoy that and then remember what their , what they have gone through fondly . Now , you mentioned something that fascinates me , You said you went to Syria . So I think this is another important point for people to understand is that the combat artists , you're not just , you know , sitting in a room someplace you are , you're out there , you're soldiers , experienced soldiers who are being sent to , you know , different areas , combat areas or , or , or else . So you said you went to Syria , Is there any place else that you've deployed in your tenure as the combat artists in residence ? Unfortunately , Covid , uh , put a , put a damper on my , on my deployments there . Um , because I was , I was set to actually deploy to Afghanistan , but then the stop move to um , for Covid hit and I wasn't able to kick it back up in time . Oh , wow . So , I mean , it's it's kind of tough . Um , but yeah , I managed to get my way into to o ir and document some of the activities over there which were absolutely substantial . I was over there with the introduction of the Bradleys into Syria , which was a major event during that time line . And that is one of the pieces that I'm working on right now . It's very , very interesting . Now , again , you mentioned , you know , Covid came in because you , you got into this position 2019 shortly thereafter , we're in Covid . But um , you've done some really impressive pieces that document the army during Covid . Can you , can you talk about those ? Absolutely . So one of the pieces I created um for my Covid series is the blessing in the hands and uh , we'll take a step back . So obviously when Covid came around , we realized that it was going to be a major event and we started trying to figure out what was going to be the best way to actually kind of communicate . Um , what is going on because it's a silent enemy . There's no visual representation of like what this event actually was . So it's kind of tough um , trying to actually piece that together . So one of the things that I saw was there's a lot of medical stuff going on , I guess . Right . So one of the things that I saw was that there was a event happening right at the beginning of Covid and it was called nurses week . And so during nurses week , all the respective chaplains go around and they bless the hands of the nurses and doctors . Um , during that time frame . And what struck me was the removal of the intimacy of the event because of all the Covid restrictions that applied . So I started thinking about that and I started trying to figure out how to communicate Covid . And it struck me that all the protective measures were what caused that to , to uh , to strike you as a , as a covid related piece because now you're dealing with masks and gloves and non physical contact between two people . Um , normally when you like bless someone , it's , it's dipping a finger in holy water and then actually putting that on the individual and instead , now it's a q tip with gloved hands and everybody's mast and double layers of protection and things like that . So trying to put that into a painting to actually convey that that's actually during Covid . And I've seen these pieces and um , it's very impressive . And , and again , you , you capture that moment . You , you see the , the fact that it's , it's not just people in medical gear , but it's people taking extra precautions . I think it really does a great job in capturing the moment and telling the army story during Covid . Um , but let's take a look back a little bit . Um , you're the current army artist in residence . Um , but tell me a little bit more about the history of this program . How long has it been around and why was it created ? So the army artist in residence position has been created since 1991 . But the Army Combat Art Program has been around since World War I . And in various forms , it has been around and changed significantly since then . Um , it has gone away a couple of times and we've brought it back thankfully because it's a , it's a much needed , uh , part of the army and end of history . Yeah . And , and um , the changes in technology I think have also changed the the approach . But um , but I know what , like back in World War One , the army hired . I don't , I don't know how many artists and sent them out there to combat . And we've got some great artwork from World War One forward . Absolutely . So they , they , they commissioned a bunch of artists to go out during World War One and produce a bunch of artwork and it was absolutely phenomenal . And they started to do the same thing in World War Two . And then they , I think they ran out of funds . So they then they started requesting civilian positions and Time magazine sent out a lot of different artists to document and luckily for us , we acquired the , um , Time magazine collection , which has some of the best artwork I've ever seen . Um , especially tom lee . I absolutely love those paintings . And um , and then , but even before World War One there , the army has commissioned artists to do things on occasion . But then there were just civilians and soldiers who created their own artwork . And so a lot of that artwork is in the army art collection now . Um , from really a revolution not up until modern day . Um , so , um , it's , it's really fascinating to see these . And , and um , so , um , how important is this program to the army today ? I believe this program is extremely important because I think we can capture a different side of the history that seems to kind of get lost in the weeds . Um , photography only goes so far and it only seems to last in people's memories for a certain amount of time . Uh , people people relate to and memorize , uh , piece of fine art work for a lot longer and it sticks with them , especially very potent ones . Like some of the Wolf paintings from World War One or the tom lee paintings from World War 21 of the ones that strikes me is Elsie Goldens from um Afghanistan , Early Afghanistan . The Hunt from the Hunt for Bin laden especially . Yeah , you mentioned the wolf paintings in World War One . I think it's my favorite painting so far in the army art collections . The gas attack where they're running through the trenches , putting on the gas masks and you see the explosions . It's it's a captivating um uh picture that to me tells the entire story of World War One . The soldiers experience in World War One , it just the way it captures the soldier's life and and what they were going through . It's just incredible . Um So now let's talk a little bit more about the the current program , you've been the army artist now , three years you're going starting your fourth year . Um How , how long do artists serve in these positions ? So the Army artists position is a three year um stint with a possible extension of for which I was approved for um which leads me to talk about the next thing replacing me as the next army artist . Right , so let's talk about that . So um as you start looking for the next artist . Um first of all who is eligible in the army and what skills are you specifically looking for ? So right now we're looking for soldiers in the E 68 positions um that are deployable and have talent and fine art . Um Those are the main criteria that we're looking for . I originally the position was created for the 25 Mike Field And we have recently opened it up to all positions so that we have a bigger talent pool . And then the 25 Mike is what that's combat illustrator , is it ? That is the multimedia illustrator , multimedia . Okay . All right . But now it's open to any mos yes , sir , because you've really seen that there's soldiers who could be an infantry soldier or medic or or whatever , but they have the talent , the skills that that you're really looking for . Absolutely , there's there's a lot of people out there that can do a lot of different things outside of their normal duty position . And we want to find those people where I'm working pretty hard at trying to expand the art community within the army right now , I'm working small and trying to build it bigger as we go along and hopefully the my replacement will be on board to doing that . And um so what do they have to do to apply , like , do they have to submit um pieces of art or what type of already looking for ? What's the process , So we're gonna have everyone submit a portfolio and there's gonna be other different criteria that they're gonna have to submit as well . Uh such as uh letters of recommendation there srb some more admin paperwork and stuff like that . Um But the portfolio is a big one . Obviously not a whole lot of people are going to have art that is related to the army um which is fine really , what we're looking for is a talent , skill and vision and passion is the big one . Passion is always the big one , and people mistake um Passion for a lot of different things , especially when it comes to art , but passion is the ability to want to grow and learn . And the minute you start having that type of passion the more you want to grow and learn and the better you'll get and that's all we're really kind of looking for . Yeah , great . So I mean if anybody is listening to this that has a passion for art or knows someone who does , they need to start looking uh looking into this program because we'll be hiring over the course of what sometime in 2023 . Yes , sir . Uh So we'll be putting those timelines in that criteria out soon . Um We're gonna we're working on it as we speak , we're gonna finalize it and then push it out as soon as we can and will get pushed out army wide , or they can always come to our website at history dot army dot mil to see what that is . We have a whole web page dedicated to the army artist or the combat art and our army artist in residence . Now you did mention something I would like to expand on is you're doing some work right now to um expand the interest of army art within the army . And um something about interns , can , can you talk about that ? Yes , sir . So I'm working on an internship program to expand the the art program within the army . Um So I have a multiple different things that I'm trying to accomplish with that . But the main thing is to get artists that are passionate about it and want to learn and want to progress and I want to bring them in and teach them more about it . Um expand the art community and then that way they can take their their increased skill sets back out to the field and then eventually when they when they start hitting that higher level position , they can vie for this position , right ? Yeah . So develop more of an interest and an awareness about the Army Artist in residence program and um have more people competing for for the program as well . And who would be able to apply for those internships ? Is it any mos or is it that still limited to a specific mos ? Well , right now , I'm working , I'm working with specific units um just because of the way that we have to fund it and everything else I had eventually , my plan would be to get it . Um army widen mos um irrelevant . Great but that's gonna take some time . No that's fine but it's it's it's getting the word out and I think you're doing a great job of doing that and um I hope people will will look for this . Um late 2022 into early 2023 . So how can people actually get to see some of your artwork and the artwork of other combat artists ? So right now we have a we primarily go through the center of military history's facebook and instagram combat art page and um we have stuff all over the yeah there's links on the website too as I mentioned on the kombat art program and in museums around the country . Um Army museums and I know sometimes we do um have um lending programs with other civilian museums that that want to see and use our art in their own exhibits . So it can be seen in a lot of places . Um But definitely uh if people are interested they can check out our website history dot army dot mil or our social media programs on facebook and instagram and also on twitter and we do highlight on our social media every friday at a minimum we call it army art friday so people can go and see some of our army art but um but we also scattered the art throughout throughout the week as well . So good lots of places to see it . So um Sergeant load or anything else that you want to add that we didn't cover . Trying to think , I don't know , pretty much covered everything else I think . But um All right , so let's let's get straight into the houla trivia . So it's um it's this little segment that we want to just talk a little bit about some trivia about the topic at hand . So you have something that you want to um you want to highlight ? I do . So one of the things is there has only been Eight Army artists since the artists and residents position was established in 1991 . Which is absolutely amazing . It's a yeah , so she shows you how much of a prominent position it is and how how valuable it is kind of to to touch on something we talked about before and they've all deployed . Right , they've all gone a lot of different places . So what are some of the most um interesting places have that these eight combat artists , including yourself have deployed to I believe we've covered every major war um that we've deployed to . We've covered um desert , desert , storm , desert shield , Afghanistan , Iraq Syria . Um I mean those are the major ones . We've got 20 years of Afghanistan back there . Yeah , yeah , definitely . Um I think I've seen some artwork from Kosovo Bosnia . Um Oh yeah . Since way before we've we've we had teams of we had teams of army artists out in Vietnam . Alright yeah . Which produced a substantial amount of artwork and some of its absolutely amazing . But the but the artists also get to travel with um um to other places , not necessarily just combat but um all over I know some artists have gone visited since the army artist in residence program started uh Korea europe central America um throughout the United States . Just capturing , as you said before , those those stories , those soldier stories . Oh absolutely . Uh my predecessor uh Mr munoz , soon to be star major munoz um documented uh Southeast Asia and then also he documented the wounded warrior games . Oh yes yeah . Those are some great images and uh I know each each year we do highlight those on on our social media so well . Great . Well good . Well thank you so much appreciate you coming in today and for your discussion and insights about uh the army art program and specifically the Army artist in residence program . And if anyone wants to learn more about the Army artist program or about the Army art collection and army history , please explore our website at history dot army dot mil . And if you want to experience army history every day and visit our social media sites on facebook twitter and instagram please join us every week on this podcast for more in depth discussions about army history as we cover topics from all eras of the U . S . Army examining battles , soldier experiences , equipment , weapons and tactics . Thanks for joining us today on the United States Army history and Heritage podcast for the Center of Military History , I'm lee Reynolds and until next time we're history . The views expressed in this podcast reflect those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views policies or opinions of the U . S . Army or Department of Defense . For more information about the Army's proud history and heritage , go to history dot army dot mil mm hmm .